Quinn Robertson: [00:00:00] We're in a world where like we're having to plant the first trees right now. But we're starting to see some of that recycling, and that's exciting to see.

There are bridges to be built to capital sources. There's probably a supply of capital problem in a lot of these tier two, tier three markets.

You have access to capital. It just may not be within like a five-mile radius of where you're sitting right now.

90% of the battle is get into the room, get into the view of what's going on.

Figure out how and why you want to be involved.

What about the, like thousands of one person, $10 million companies? 

Andrew Kazlow: Welcome to the Diligent Observer, where we help angel investors see what most miss. I'm your host, Andrew, and every week we explore what works, what doesn't, and why through conversations with experienced startup investors and operators.

My guest today is Quinn Robertson, who leads the 412 Angels in Northwest Arkansas and is dedicated to building startup ecosystems in America's [00:01:00] Heartland.

 Quinn has dedicated over half a decade to growing investment ecosystems in tier two markets like Northwest Arkansas. And in this episode, we explore his contrarian take on the access to capital problem, learn about some of the niche industries that this part of the world is most well known for, and break down the emerging micro SaaS trend.

I hope you enjoy learning from Quinn as much as I did.

Quinn, thanks for being with me today.

Quinn Robertson: Absolutely. I'm excited to be here.

Andrew Kazlow: Well, I'd love to start with my classic first question, and that is, what are you most excited about right now?

Quinn Robertson: As I was thinking about this, we have a lot of new, interesting, fun tech right now that is, you know, it's AI, it's a bunch of other things. And it's less the the, the fun little tech. It's more that I think there's gonna be a ton of like micro SaaS businesses that are gonna get built in the next 5, 10 years or so.

And the question [00:02:00] then boils down to like, how do we invest in them? Are they even venture investible? Like how do these integrate into a portfolio? If someone was gonna raise capital for something like this? I dunno. I, My perspective is we're gonna see a lot more of those. They don't fit in the natural like,

VC home run or bus type of concept. And so, it's gonna be really interesting to track just what happens with all of those. You know, you talk about like the, the one person unicorn type of thing. What about the, like thousands of one person, $10 million companies? So I don't know. That's gonna be a fun one to track.

Andrew Kazlow: Can you define micro SaaS for me? Like what does that mean to you?

Quinn Robertson: Yeah, so think of it as like, you know, probably, small in team, also probably small in scope. So thinking about it as very, very niche use case. Very small market, but can solve a very small market's problem really well, instead of being the ERP for trade services. Like you narrow [00:03:00] in on lawn care. You narrow in on, inbound or customer success or like, whatever it may be. I think that we're gonna have the ability for those to just be very good and very deep, but just like very pointed. So that's when I, when I think about like micro SaaS, that's kind of where my mind goes to. We're like, there's not a billion dollar market in here, but there's a $10 million market or a $20 or $50 million market. So that's kind what I think about there.

Andrew Kazlow: How do you think that will influence the rollup strategies? Maybe a little bit later on in the ecosystem? Because as you're talking, it seems like a pretty natural evolution for a rollup kind of strategy to come in and pick up the 17 different, unique, focused applications, roll 'em all together and, and go, right? Flip it in a couple of years. Do you see that happening? Like what do you see maybe impacting the mid to to later markets?

Quinn Robertson: I've seen a few funds that have gotten together with sort of this strategy and they don't immediately come to mind, but I've seen a few on VC [00:04:00] Twitter, LinkedIn VC, all of that type of stuff. So I've seen a couple of them start to get instigated. I've also seen this in like Venture Studio form where you've got a lot of folks that are saying, how can we use AI?

Some of these agents, you know, insert buzzword, tech of the day. But like, how do we use these to build a studio that's gonna launch twenty, a hundred, a thousand companies a year, um, instead of the standard on that front. So I'll be curious to see not only on the origination side, but then also on the later stage, like I think the answer is yes. It probably ends up as micro private equity or private equity hold coast that are doing a bunch of different acquisitions, um, that's where my thought goes to at least. But yeah, I think we're still a few years away from seeing that play of.

Andrew Kazlow: You know, it's so interesting to just think about feels like the private markets in general have just gotten more and more and more and more attention, like even in the few years that, you know, I've been actively [00:05:00] working in the space, it just feels like the macro kind of awareness of what's happening here is increasing.

Everybody wants to participate and so it's just getting more and more and more competitive. And so I think my general sense, I'd be curious if you agree with this. My general sense is that, the storylines and the return profiles of the last 30 years aren't likely to match up with the next 30 given this massive influx of competition even, even in these really small niche in a private market spaces, especially now with some of the current conversation happening. I don't even know where we stand right now, but I heard recently on the news that there's been some interest in increasing access to private capital. You know, allowing 401(k)s to participate in private assets. Uh, Just react to me like, are you feeling the same trend?

Quinn Robertson: It will certainly look different. That is for sure. You see it in in private markets today and where capital is going, right? You've got this massive of, of capital that's going to a few really, really big funds. And then you've got just this [00:06:00] sort of long tail of small emerging or micro funds or emerging managers.

You wonder if the startups themselves may follow that as well. And so are there gonna be a few massive winners in some certain spaces, but then a lot of like $50 to $250 million acquistion. And like how do you build a return profile or a fund portfolio outta that? Not certain. I also think some of the legislation about opening up capital markets to how do we expand, what does an accredited investor mean?

Uh, Those are interesting to follow as well. I think general access, you know, personal opinion, I think general access is probably good given some level of financial sophistication or you pass a test, I dunno what the mechanism should be, but like, I think with some level of ability, if you can go either, you know, buy a lottery ticket or you can go and, get a series 65 or whatever those things may be.

Like you've got the knowledge to start to invest in these types of things. I think maybe the opinion [00:07:00] that is maybe counter to what some of the major messaging is, is that gonna significantly impact, uh, how much dollar or how many dollars flow into VC, right? If you've got us a company raising a million bucks, you know, you can have a couple of conversations, get to half million dollar checks from VC funds and like be on your merry way.

Do we see a world in which like, you're gonna go and get a bunch of $10 and $100 checks to do all of this as well. I don't know. I think it might be more effort than what it's worth per perspectively. So like, are there gonna be more people involved in the asset class? Yes. Is it gonna make a meaningful difference in the total dollars in the asset class?

I'm probably more of a skeptic there, but it'll be, I'll be curious to see what happens with it, but I love conceptually it for sure.

Andrew Kazlow: Well, that is one that, all of us will continue to track very closely. What else? Maybe, dial in for me a little more regionally. You're, You've bet, pretty hard, it seems like from your career so far on kinda the Arkansas [00:08:00] ecosystem, the Heartland. Tell me more about what you're excited about.

Maybe a little bit more regionally that, those of us listening in from Silicon Valley or Texas where I sit, or the East Coast, aren't seeing.

Quinn Robertson: I would describe it as momentum is building right now. So I got into sort of VC land, angel land, startup land in like late 2019. And so that was sort of my first foray into all of that. And then the world shuts down like three months later. And, uh, you know, you're on you're on portfolio management for like 12 months, so, um, but at least in like the last five years,

there were some seedlings of, you'll see a random startup pop up in a lot of the cities that I look at are like Kansas City, Wichita, Oak City, Tulsa, Northwest Arkansas, Little Rock, like that's kind of the geo that normally I take a peak at. You're starting to see some real wins on the board.

Kansas City had a couple of really big exits. BacklotCars was a massive exit for a lot of [00:09:00] folks. I think there was, I think there was a bunch of angel capital, a local, a bunch of local VC capital in there. So you're starting to see in some of these like tier two, tier three cities where I'm at, some wins kind of pop off and some liquidity start to drive back.

Where in Austin, San Francisco, some of those other places like trees, bud and form, and there's just like trees upon trees. We're in a world where like we're having to plant the first trees right now. But we're starting to see some of that recycling, and that's exciting to see. We're also seeing some folks from outside the region come into the region, take some interesting best practices and knowledges.

As an example, there's a gal in town, here in northwest Arkansas called Serafina Lalany, who um, from Houston originally. Did some amazing work there bringing, um, how do we bring in capital from outside regions into local region? And so she's got that effort that's going on in Northwest Arkansas that didn't exist like 18 months ago.

And I know [00:10:00] that there are similar versions of those in some of these other cities. So, I think we are still seeing like local capital try to like, We're, we're a, we're smaller market, so we don't have the density, so we're like slow and steady building those up. But we're also trying and getting a lot more visibility into local markets as well that frankly I don't think existed maybe five years ago.

So those are all really exciting things to follow on that front. We're in a world where like we work in decades, we're planting seeds right now. We're starting to water them and like little saplings are starting to come up and so it's gonna be another 5 to 10 years before we see the real effects from all of them, but like everything moving in the right direction, which is cool.

Andrew Kazlow: One of the things that's always really interesting to me about these, tier two, tier three markets is,

you look at any market and it's at that point, at one time in its lifecycle, right? None of, none of the, nobody starts out as a big huge market for blank right there. There is always a beginning. I think one of the things that's so interesting to me is [00:11:00] the depth of relationships that are just so meaningful and those bonds, how strong they are kind of in those early days, right?

Like, ah, we were the first, you know, investors in blank right in, in this city, and you just get to know everybody and it's like, oh, there's five people doing this. And so we all know each other and we get coffee every week. And that's just really unique and you, you kind of lose that as the community evolves into what they would call tier one.

Give me like Quinn's mind map of the ecosystem, like double click just a little bit. Because I'm, I'm less familiar. I've, been through the area, but never really spent time. Walk me through, like, how does this ecosystem work? Who are the major players? Where are things happening?

What are you really well known for locally? React to any of that, and kinda walk me through how you, how you would break down the system to an outsider.

Quinn Robertson: Yeah, totally. I'll give this through the lens of like northwest Arkansas. For those that aren't familiar, we're in the northwest corner. You've got Bentonville, which is like Walmart retail world up in [00:12:00] sort of the north end. And then you've got a few other big companies that are here.

You've got, um, JB Hunt, Tyson, Simmons, et cetera, that are all located here. You've got the university down on like the south side in Fayetteville, and all of that sort of exists as like Northwest Arkansas. So, like Big players in the startup community space here, from a capital perspective, we have a few funds that are based here.

The major ones that most folks know about are, there's a group here called New Road Capital. Think of them as like series B-esque Very focused on supply chain logistics, kind of, uh, retail-ish oriented in that world. There's a lot of, a lot of JB Hunt knowledge, a lot of Walmart logistics knowledge that are leading that group there.

Series B, like, big, big fund. Um, you've got a group here called Cadre Capital that is like series A fund. Think of them as like series A non-lead. But like also very supply chain, [00:13:00] uh, DOD, like they've got some really good expertise that they're doing with that. And then you've got like my angel group, which is the 412 Angel Group.

We are very much like early stage capital on that front. But when you look at like seed stage, pre-seed stage funding, there's not a heck of a lot of like organized capital in Northwest Arkansas. So you have things where we're looking to outside players to be like, Hey, come and take a look at the stuff that's going on here.

And so a lot of our like pre-seed, seed stage capital is coming in from outside of this region. And I think at some point you'll start to see some funds bubble up there. That makes sense. We have some people that are starting to move and put like part-time residency in here. But like it's, there's probably 10 of those doing some part-time stuff and it'll be really cool to see a lot of folks start to do anchor flags here at some point. There's also some like state funds money that are coming outta Little Rock as well. So like that's kind of the capital [00:14:00] scene that exists here. There's some really good efforts. A lot of it is funded. There's a very large, philanthropic organization here, the Walton Family Foundation. That is a major player relative to how do you get support organizations, nonprofit organizations that are wrapping their arms around these startups.

And they're the ones that are doing a lot of the heavy lifting with that, which is really great to see. We are seeing as any kind of tier two, tier three market might see, like we're young in our, number of startups that kind of walk through the pipe. Um, and so we're trying to figure out how do we get more of them. And so some of that exists as what are the curriculums that are going on at the local university, at the University of Arkansas to spin out more computer science engineers, product-oriented people, salespeople, et cetera. But we're also seeing some philanthropic effort really go in, in the form of studios.

Um, so we have, I want to say 1, [00:15:00] 2, 3, or four studios, in Northwest Arkansas. And like, they're a really core, really interesting generation mechanism of new startups. Some of them are like, National Lab research oriented. There's a lot of effort around what we locally will call the retail value chain. So anything from product inception all the way to, it's sitting on a retail shelf at some point. We've got, Walmart and a bunch of the CPG brands, and secondary and tertiary support services that are all based here. So there's a bunch of knowledge here. And so the retail value chain is a core area where we're seeing a lot of generation from in the form of like studios or accelerator programs as an example. There's a few accelerator programs also that exist. Some of them are a little niche. Um, you've got like, uh, a biking-oriented one. Um, Apparently Northwest Arkansas is the world capital of mountain biking, which I didn't know this was a thing when I moved [00:16:00] back. So we have like a biking and an outdoor wreck oriented accelerator.

We've got a couple of health tech-oriented accelerators. Supply chain logistics accelerators as well. Some of them like locally-oriented, some of them like nationally-oriented. And how do we bring some of those folks into Northwest Arkansas? So there's, there's some grow your own mentality.

There's also like the import mentality as well. How do we get really smart people that make sense here as well? And then we also have some later stage stuff as well. My, um, My angel group sits underneath a global nonprofit called Endeavor. They're in like 40 some odd NASH or global markets. We have a, an office here in Bentonville that kind of covers the Heartland region and we're doing some really amazing work with some later stage companies and starting to do some more work accelerator type stuff with some earlier stage stuff too.

So, um. All in, like there's a lot of effort around there. We're trying to like, one [00:17:00] support the entrepreneurs that are here. We're trying to like programmatically grow more and there's a very concerted effort there. And we're also trying to like import a bunch of folks in. So we're attacking it from like a bunch of different angles to figure out like, how do you get more awesome people that are walking through the ecosystem?

And it's a slow process, we're talking years and decades, not weeks and months. So it's, it's a fun part to be, It's a fun time to be a part of the local community here.

Andrew Kazlow: I love the, like hyper niche use cases, like, Oh yeah, the mountain biking capital of everything. Like that's amazing. I feel like that's what gets me excited about a lot of these, these ecosystems is that there are these pockets of like, this is the mecca of blank. For this really niche community.

And so it can be a very compelling story. Why would you go anywhere else if you're in that space? Um, So what I'm hearing is kind of main thematic focuses for the region are a lot of logistics, retail, um, you know, hyper focus and kinda the [00:18:00] biking space, which is cool to know about. Some healthcare logistics as well, like any other kinda major themes that you see represented really clearly or that you would, you know, go on stage and talk about.

These are focuses for our community.

Quinn Robertson: Yeah, those probably hit the main ones. We certainly have, you know, you mentioned health tech as well. We've got quite a bit of new momentum coming in with a couple of big, um, philanthropic kind of grants and, efforts around the healthcare community in northwest Arkansas. So the assumption is that there will be some more tech that will also pop up with that as well.

So, We have some accelerator programs around that too. But I think the ones that you hit are probably like, that's the bread and butter right now. I would also say like, we're trying to figure out, do we want to be more than just that? And, sometimes if I'm not sitting into these nice clean and easy little buckets, like where do I go to?

And, And that's a fair question for some cities that have sort of that perspective [00:19:00] around what their startup community is, and what are the pillars that are associated with it. Also then like what's the programming and support that kind of gets wrapped around for some of that. So I think we're trying to figure out like how do you take the core and then like sort of, uh, tangentially plug into some of the, and continue, continue to expand the envelope from there.

I dunno what that's gonna look like, but I know that there's some folks, myself included, that are thinking about that type of stuff.

Andrew Kazlow: To continue that, something that you and I have spoken about a bit previously is, the quote, unquote access to capital problem. I'd love to maybe dovetail into that. Can you explain what that means and uh, your take on that, at least for, for your community.

Quinn Robertson: I probably will come across a little contrarian with this, so I'm interested to see what the comments are on the, you know, what the comment section looks like after this. I think in a lot of middle of the country communities, the common perspective is there's just no capital. You have to basically move to San Francisco, move to Austin, move to New York if you [00:20:00] want access to capital. There's just nothing here. And I think there are instances, let me be very clear where there that that's true, right? You have to sort of have bridges built into capital pockets in order to be able to access that capital.

I totally agree. I don't have a personal perspective that says, in order for you to be successful, the capital that you may or may not need to grow your business needs to come from like your local community. I'll give you an example. When I was back in Wichita. We had a Web3 blockchain founder who was in the middle of Wichita, Kansas, not known shockingly enough for like Web3 crypto stuff in the world, randomly DMs, Anthony Pompliano on, I forget which channel. And like comes in, ends up leading his seed round or his pre-seed round gets a few other like really big crypto investors on there and like ends up getting a round pulled together from random cold [00:21:00] DM on social media platform. And so kind of like my contrarian take on, there's an access to capital problem.

Understanding that yes, there are certainly cases where that is true. I think there are a lot of communities where, if this is an interesting investible company that's starting to show some good momentum. You have access to capital. It just may not be within like a five-mile radius of where you're sitting right now.

And so if you're sitting in Bentonville, Arkansas. There are people around you that want to see you succeed, that, assuming that this is an interesting investible deal, all of those check bar boxes obviously exist. There are people around you that will plug you into other capital communities.

That could be great mechanisms for you to get the early capital that you need on that front. And so I think the access to capital issue. I think I personally don't see it nearly as prevalent. There are bridges to be built [00:22:00] to capital sources. There's probably a supply of capital problem in a lot of these local, in a lot of these tier two, tier three markets.

I don't necessarily see it as significantly as an access to capital problem, um, is maybe how I might distinguish it.

Andrew Kazlow: So for Bentonville area specifically, or you know, you know, pick a city, like what's the current through line that you hear often d you know, thrown around casual conversations and maybe like more concisely for me, you know, how would you counter, or how would you react to that through line when you hear it, you know, said over coffee or you're meeting with a founder. Like, gimme an example of what that conversation looks like practically.

Quinn Robertson: The through line that I do frequently here in Bentonville, and it's changing, or in Northwest Arkansas and it's certainly changing. But there is a message of we have an access to capital problem. And I think the way that I, in a conversation I would counteract that, is if you're looking for capital within 10 miles of where you're [00:23:00] sitting, and especially if you're like pre-seed stage, maybe seed stage.

Your options are probably very limited. You're exactly right. We have some of these things that are starting to get built up, but if you're looking and that's your nexus of thought, you're probably pretty right. The challenge I would bring back to them is like, go out to the publicly facing like air tables on LinkedIn and VC Twitter and whatever they may be, where you like.

It's like the VC lists of lists that you always see sort of get thrown around there. Go find 10 of those. Filter down to like stage, location will lead, check size, like all of the things you need on that front. I will bet you like there's probably, fifty to a hundred firms out there that will take a look at your deck because you fit into their thesis.

Go and do those things. And then if you get nos from a hundred outta a hundred, then like, okay, that's the market, giving you a signal on that front. Um, So like my opinion on [00:24:00] that is don't just look five miles from where you're at. Is it a great place to get some like friends and family, like, there's a little bit of like a halo effect that exists there, I think, I think everywhere that naturally exists.

Um, but like you have to expand your process much larger. The market of capital is not just sitting in your, same community, at whatever stage like this, this belief that I'm at the like idea stage or PowerPoint deck stage or like Figma prototype stage, and I need an angel investor to come save the day.

There are institutional funds that wanna invest in founders at that stage. That mantra of go find your local angel. That's the only way you're gonna be able to get a little bit forward. I don't think it's real.

Andrew Kazlow: Well, speaking of that, I mean, maybe let's talk about 412 Angels specifically and like where, where you see your community fit in and what gets you guys excited. Talk about some of the recent activities, some of the things that, you know, your community is specifically excited [00:25:00] about.

Quinn Robertson: Yeah, yeah, yeah. So 412 Angels Program launched about three years ago. I took the helm maybe two years ago. Um, really objective is, how do you get more capital flowing from Northwest Arkansas, right? Um, certainly a perspective that says, if we can build out an army of individuals that can become your capital base of the future, that lends to a great support system, a great pillar in the community for when the next Sam Walton walks through our door in, you know, the next couple of years.

We have a mechanism that we can be the first, place that they can go to, to get off the ground and continue to go. My job, my focus, find, educate, activate, prospective, and existing angel investors in the northwest Arkansas community. We may look larger long term, but today really focused on, on northwest Arkansas.

 I would say, a [00:26:00] lot of our group, which is really a part of, and the reason for the group existing is we've got a lot of folks that like angel investing is not the thing they've been doing for the last 20 years. A lot of folks are new to the asset class, they're learning the asset class.

Some folks are like sitting on the sidelines and figuring out, how do I get involved? How do I get engaged, dip my toe in and learn and be kind osmosis in the nature in a little while. Naturally with that, the things that we typically look at are not the PowerPoint deck human being and their dog in a garage, like starting to build the thing at the earliest stages. A lot of these folks have been. They've got wealth that's sitting in traditional asset classes or maybe real estate. And this is like their first foray into the private markets of private equity and venture. And so a million dollars in revenue is still really early for them. And so a lot of what we are typically looking at as a group [00:27:00] is, I'll get uh, a very slightly honest, a soapbox VC nomenclature needs to get thrown in the trash, from rounds and all of that type of stuff. Personal perspective there. so like To the world, I would say we're like seed stage investors or like early A or like Midwest A investors. But really I view that as like a hundred or a couple hundred thousand in revenue up to like a million or two in revenue. You've got someone more than just like your mom, your dog, and your hamster have bought the thing. So you're starting to get a little bit of that going, but like, okay, something is starting to get proven here, but let's start to get on the gas pedal.

That's really where we typically look at from a stage perspective and then verticals. It's kind of the 80/20 rule. The 80% is, what do these folks know in my local community? So it's supply chain tech, logistics, tech, retail, tech, ad tech, like all of those things that make sense here are the things that probably [00:28:00] 80% will fit into.

But I also have the perspective, like we have some docs that are in the group as well. And so if it's random health tech thing that they've got a certain level of expertise or could support on that front. I also have the perspective that says folks should continue to build out a diverse portfolio, and so should you invest 100% of your angel or VC-oriented dollars in seed stage supply chain deals.

You can do that, some folks might say you want, would wanna diversify out a little bit from there. And so the other 20% is also it's experimental stuff that fits outside of that. We're not doing a lot of like highly regulated FDA, med device biotech type stuff. Outside of that, like we'll at least take a look at some of those things and then whether or not capital actually flows into them.

It's starting to kind of narrow into those, what do my local angels know buckets, I would say.

Andrew Kazlow: What do you think have been some of the most effective catalysts for [00:29:00] encouraging someone to become an angel investor because I think that's such an interesting opportunity that we have as an ecosystem. Angel investing is a very new thing. Very often I'm hearing the story you just shared, which is that we're, you know, we're a way for people that are new to this asset class to jump in and participate, and so activating capital that's already qualified and could be participating, but that is just latent is an interesting problem to me. So I'm curious, from your several years now serving in this or similar capacities. What have been some of the key like trigger points or activation mechanisms? I don't know how you want to describe it, but like what gets somebody off of the couch into the game?

Quinn Robertson: I would say, and this is something that I'm, I don't know, six years into doing some of this now I'm still learning what some of these things are, but like one of the through lines that I have found is, it's almost non-investment reasons. You [00:30:00] almost think about, I've got a core group of, let's call it 50 people.

They're friends and like, hey, here's this fun thing that I'm doing. Is like the reason that they walk into the room, at least. Does it get 'em writing a check? No, but I would say like 90% of the battle is get into the room, get into the view of what's going on. And that at least gets you like on a pathway to like, at least via osmosis, start to think through some of this. I have had folks where it's the friend of the person that they already know, and so like it's comradery is a part of it. I actually was having a conversation with someone just this week. You know, They may write some checks into stuff, but this is the mechanism, thinking of it as like almost professional development.

How do I stay at the forefront of new stuff that's coming down the pipe that I, in my day job, that I'm spending 60 hours a week dedicated to? This is the mechanism for me to be aware of what's coming down the [00:31:00] pipe so I can actually be better in my current role. so like Some of those non investing reasons I think are the reason why people get like level of interest and excitement.

I think when you go completely out of the blue, you've never heard of me, you've never heard of what angel investing is and you're like having a conversation with someone. It can be very intimidating to try and walk in the door with people that, I don't know, for reasons that I can't fully understand about these investments that may go to zero or may hit the moon.

Like that's really hard to digest. And so at least when I've talked to folks, finding the other mechanisms for folks to be like, why would I want to learn or be around these, like.  Well To do individuals in local community and like amazing entrepreneurs that wanna go and change the world, there are alternate reasons for why they might wanna be in the room. That then gets them [00:32:00] step one, down the path of like step 10 being write the check. That's at least what I've found. If you or any other folks that are listening to this have other thought processes around that, send them my way, I'm totally up for, for new stuff that comes my way as well.

But that's kind of what I've seen. We're also like a very relational and, I might say risk averse community. I think there's a lot of communities out there like that as well. So that just may be like for our specific community. Why people are starting to kind of engage for different reasons that purpose.

So it's probably different for a lot of other folks, but there's probably other communities that feel similar to us in that regard.

Andrew Kazlow: It's an interesting problem because so many, so many of these communities. Angel communities across the country are composed of this blend of members that are like long timers. You know, they're in it for life. They just like the, the ecosystem and they want to give back. Whether they write a check or not, they're, they're gonna pay their dues and show up.

And then there's these one to three year kind [00:33:00] of turnover community members that come in, you know, they write, I don't know, half dozen or a dozen checks and then they're deployed and they're like, okay, now my, investment period is completed and I'm gonna hold for a few years and they roll off. And so there's this constant need for these communities to be bringing on and, and maintaining that membership.

it's a, It's a fascinating like scy psychology of like why someone would join a group like this versus just getting on AngelList and picking their favorite syndicate and getting into a million deals, with real small dollar amounts. Uh, and so I'm always curious to hear, you know, what you see as the key kind of reasons behind why somebody would join your community versus doing that or any other form of private investment, right?

Hand it to a fund manager or join some syndicate, like there's a million ways to participate.

Quinn Robertson: Yeah. And I think, let's be clear, none of them are wrong. wrong right? What I've found is, if you come from maybe tech community, um, be that geography [00:34:00] or be that, the type of like role that you're in, if you're in like software engineering or something like that, you're probably gonna get aware of some of this angel investing VC stuff more than like random human beings sitting behind corporate walls of maybe not legacy business, but close enough. Those folks, they may just be super into like the, I wanna go find my friends. And like, I love this whole concept. I'm sort of used to it already. Go find the AngelList managers, go look at the 200 deals because this is the fun thing and it's sort of in my wheelhouse.

Go and do that stuff for sure. And this is And this is one thing that you know, when I think about advice that I give to folks very early on in their angel investing career is if you're thinking about, I wanna be involved in this asset class, I always tell folks, figure out how and why you want to be involved. Because, you could go [00:35:00] write some angel checks for six to 12 months and you may love like getting to know the founder.

Maybe being super supportive and you may want to like, you kind of have the deal junkie thing where you love seeing the deals come your way. And if that's your stick, rock and roll, like there are places where you to go and activate that. Be it my group or one of the other syndicates out there.

If you get 6 to 12 months in and you're like, I can't pick stocks worth anything, or like, I ain't got time for this, or whatever other mechanism makes sense, or whatever rationale you're thinking about, you can get exposed to the asset class via a VC fund, but that's focused on pre-seed or focused on seed or certain geographies or certain verticals or, things that you care about.

So I always tell folks like, especially when you're in that 6 to 12 month area. I try to check in with folks and say, what, how are we doing? Am I just burnt out with this thing and I need to go intro you to like five VC managers that I think are interesting and like maybe one of them is the right pathway for you to get [00:36:00] exposure to the asset class.

Rock and roll. Am I the only angel group that, that you've chatted with and you just wanna go like, find more deals and I need to go enter you to like five other groups because you just wanna see more deal flow. Like that's a great pathway to do so as well. I think the, how you want to get involved is somewhat of a learned behavior. This is so new relative to other things that you get involved in that I think going and trying and dipping your toe in is certainly a good start. 

Andrew Kazlow: Quinn, any additional thoughts or final kinda takeaways you'd leave our audience with around Northwest Arkansas specifically, general investment strategies, words of wisdom, what else would you leave our, our audience with that we haven't covered?

Quinn Robertson: I think specifically as it relates to Northwest Arkansas, like you gimme the plug. I'm gonna give the chance to plug it a little bit. It's a really cool community. We're growing like crazy right now. we're trying to get more people to look at what's going on here, and we've been pretty darn [00:37:00] successful at it, I'd say over the last 6 to 12 months.

Everybody that I talk to that comes into the local community, gets surprised positively about why, about their experience here. And so, if you haven't, give me a shout. My goal is how can I roll out the red carpet for folks, be it, founders, or investors or industry, whatever it may be.

There's a lot of cool stuff going on here, so I'm excited. I'm excited to get a chance to share that with the world a little bit. And then lastly, like as I'm thinking about like VC-Angel asset class this year. As folks are thinking about, do I start angel investing this year? Do I continue angel investing this year?

My message back to folks, I was talking with one of my local angels just yesterday over a, an adult beverage. Um, And, uh, it was thinking about this as you're gonna be investing through seasons and cycles, right? You think about your public portfolios and [00:38:00] you're gonna invest in the ups and the downs and you're always gonna put the monthly check out the door to go to the 401(k) type of thing.

Markets have looked a little squirrely this year from the public perspective of like up and then down and like now we're like having an okay year so far, seven months in. There's some level of perception on like certain markets are getting hit and I think that's totally fair.

I think consistently getting checks out the door, the biggest mistake that I see a lot of early angel investors doing is too small of a portfolio size. And like, only when I see the one or two deals a year that I think are gonna be the ones and like the markets look good and like all of the things line up is when I'm gonna write the check.

I would much rather, if you're thinking about your overall portfolio, your overall allocation, smaller checks, more companies. The best people on the planet are really right in these types of deals, 1 outta 10 times. So you gotta put at least 10 checks out the door [00:39:00] and you gotta start to build that portfolio there.

So that'd be like the final message on if it's the one takeaway on why, how to get involved and how to think about this in the ups, in the downs. There are great companies that come outta every market cycle, so that'd be the thought process there.

Andrew Kazlow: Well, a hundred percent behind you on that point. Uh, we talked at length about portfolio theory within the angel context, at a recent live series at the Angel Capital Association annual event. One episode in particular with John Harbison, breaks down a lot of the math behind that. So if you're listening to this and curious, check out that episode.

Quinn, how can our listeners stay in touch with you? Follow your work? What's the best way?

Quinn Robertson: Wanna know more more about the 412 Angels. 4-1-2, the numbers, angels.com is our website. Quinn-Robertson on LinkedIn I think is who I am, but I know that there are not many of me out there, and especially not in Northwest Arkansas. There are [00:40:00] not many. So like. Type in Quinn Robertson.

Find the guy that like, at least today has like a black sweater, and like weird looking eye in his LinkedIn profile picture that's like slightly squinted. So like if you find that, that's where I'm at. I'm not on any other social media and I actually consider it like proud of that. So all of like the weird squirrels that goes on VC Twitter and all of that, I miss it.

Are there some professional negatives that, I'm probably experiencing because of that? Yes. Are there a lot personal social positives that I'm getting for not being on Twitter? Also So Linked is where most folks would find me. 

Andrew Kazlow: Well, Quinn, thanks for joining me today. I look forward very much to our next conversation.

Thanks for listening to this episode of The Diligent Observer. I'm your host, Andrew, and if you're an angel investor looking for essential angel intel in five minutes every week, I think you'd enjoy my newsletter. I send my best stuff, interesting deals, and more straight to your inbox so you never miss a thing.

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